Video: Bob Lutz talks about GM's diesel future
Bob Lutz, General Motors' North American chairman and favorite spokesperson of auto writers everywhere, posted a video to his Fastlane blog in which he discusses the future of diesel at GM -- and according to him, it ain't all rosy.
Bob Lutz predicts that in order to meet the most stringent EPA emissions standards, diesels of the (near) future will be much more expensive and have little fuel economy advantage over gasoline engines, especially as more manufacturers adopt gas-engine technologies such as direct fuel injection (which is currently available in several cars including GM's own Pontiac Solstice GXP.) Tuning diesels to meet the more stringent standards for California and the Northeast states, he explains, would only narrow the gap and raise the cost further.
Mr. Lutz, I'm a huge fan, but I'm not buying your take on diesel -- not after driving the 45-state-compliant Mercedes-Benz E320 BLUETEC, which returned MPG in the low 30s (compared to low-to-mid 20s for the gasoline-powered E350 under similar conditions) with comparable power and costs just $1,000 more than a similarly-equipped E350. The outgoing diesel-powered Volkswagen Jetta TDI achieved the sort of fuel economy promised by hybrids, and the new-for-2008 version is reported to be California-compliant, meeting the new super-strict "Tier 2/Bin 5" standards of which you speak.
Towards the end of the video, Bob lays out GM's plans for diesel in the US. The diesel lineup will include a V6 for passenger cars, crossovers and light trucks and an all-aluminum 4.5 liter V8 for light-duty SUVs. Automotive News ran a follow-up story (registration required) stating that the V6 is a 2.9 liter unit developed by Italian engine builder VM (who produced the unimpressive diesel engine used in the Jeep Liberty CRD) and that the engine will most likely appear in the Cadillac CTS and Saturn Aura in 2009 or 2010.
Watch the video: Checking Back With Bob -- Aaron Gold
Comments
B.S. GM already has diesels in use in some of their Opel models in Europe. I’ve driven the smallest of them and although the car didnt impress me the mileage was great as with the many other Euro diesels.
There is a difference in how/what emmissions are measured there vs here but now that this country finally has mandated a lower sulfur diesel fuel (as was the case in Europe many years ago) the mods are said to be easier.
Aaron, I agree with your take on Mr. Lutz’ diesel comments. I’m afraid they have little credibility in light of the German diesel developments and thus are clearly defensive in light of GM being far, far behind in that arena. VW looks to do extremely well with the new Jetta diesel, combining a “hot” platform with an extremely efficient powerplant that no one in North America can come close to matching for fuel economy even with a hybrid. Bob’s normal credibility is stretched thin on this one!
I think that Bob is being cautious to jumping into the diesel arena. GM is still feeling the sting of the Olds diesel debacle and the only mainstream vehicle that sells well for any automaker in the U.S. with a diesel is the light duty pickups of the 3/4 to 1 ton variety. I hope that GM being the largest automaker in North America can proliferate more diesels too the market and thereby make it more mainstream. IMHO the diesels are better than hybrids for the simple fact that they can use vegetable oil for fuel thereby using a renewable, cleaner, and safer fuel it trumps and engine on the market. One of my project cars is a 1971 Chevy Nova and I’m considering putting a Duramax Diesel into it and using vegetable oil for fuel. The costs I have calculated are in the range of .92 to 1.23/gallon.
The Jetta TDI is selling pretty well these days. I really want to buy a diesel small SUV. As to diesels not selling well in the US the simple fact is you have to buy a Jetta or MB to get a diesel car. The Liberty is a bad example because frankly I wouldn’t own any Jeep Liberty.
So Honda how about a diesel Element?
The fact is the only mainstay vehicle that has a diesel and sold well is the 3/4 to 1 ton trucks. I think that if a major automaker in the U.S. invested in a diesel for a mainstream vehicle it would sell well. VW and MB are not real big players in this market if you go by volume. I am in no way disrepecting the brands but they don’t push steel like other car companies.
I think Lutz misses the real point. GM does not have a future period. Be tween him and Mr. Gentlefinger, they are destoying what was a big but mediocre company.
Wow robo you need to clean your lenses. GM has more money in assets and more reliable tech in the works than any other automaker. The dual mode hybrids are superior to the junk that toyota and honda putout. So much so that the Germans are betting there money on it too. The cars they are bringing out are more than competitive. So tell me how a company close to a hundred years old that has brought some of the most advanced tech in cars and most gorgeous vehicles on the road(the only cars i really look at now are the ones from the 50s to early 70s) is done? I’m a betting man and will take your wager any day of the week.
Wow Andre you are talking about the cars from the 50’s to early 70’s!!! I am afraid their technology is just a bit behind. There is now something called Electronic Fuel Injection (EFI). All kidding aside, if the dual mode hybrids you speak of is so great where are all the vehicles using it?
Lee look at your regional transit authorities buses. Instead of thinking small with small cars that are already fuel efficient GM put them into buses that help multiple people commute to work. I guess when you look at hybrids all you see is the prius. LOL I love the fact that you mention EFI. I can put w/e engine and transplant w/e suspension and new tech into an older vehicle that costs less and performs better than a new one.
I’m not sure why it is that GM refuses to bring diesels to the U.S.? I’ve driven diesel Opels, Saabs and Fords, they were all DPF models. Adding a urea injector to make them Tier II Bin 5 won’t be any great difficulty. Additionally Honda already has a 4-cyl. that will meet Tier II Bin 5 and they are planning on bringing it here to the States. They recently had the Civic 5 door Euro specs. of course, in Detroit and the max:mpg guys found they could weasel up to 80 mpg on a car already rated at up to 57 mpg.
I’m sorry Detroit but once again you’re sitting on your butts and watching the lead go to someone else. The Volt will be nice but I want something the size of a Cobalt, not a 4-door Camaro. It’s simply too, big.
Lutz needs to wake up. Diesels should be as much of the alternative as E85 vehicles. Bio-diesel will become an alternative fuel in the SW USA over the next few years, and the company that provides a good turbo-diesel SUV into this market will be selling realistic numbers.
irloyal is right. I want to see diesel SUVs. Practical, and economical.
Here’s a thought: Maybe Mr.Lutz and all his good-ole-boys in upper management of the American car companies have the oil companies in their back pockets… or vice versa. I’m pretty sure that a fairly large component of the debate has been missed: if the US of A starts trending to deisel, the profits of the big American oil companies will start to decline. Less need for refineries, and less overall usage with improved mileage. Like it or not, the US economy is fueled (pardon the pun) by Petro-Dollars, and new automotive technology is influenced just as much by Lutz and his ilk as they are by Bush, Cheney, and all the other shareholders of American oil interests.
jackson,
That’s a huge leap to make. Do you also see black helicopters and big foot?
Maybe you can explain how Bush/Cheney influence oil interests? Be specific?
And, I’d also like to know how using Diesel will reduce the profits of the oil companies? People will simply drive more and still consume more fuel. If anything, more diesel cars mean a lot more profit to Big Oil due to diesel shortages and high diesel prices that are most likely to happen.
The fact of the matter is that the auto industry doesn’t want to invest in a product that may be obsolete within a few years. Developing new vehicles with new diesel technology isn’t as easy as some might think. It’s very costly and all American auto manufacturers are on the verge of BK. Investing in the wrong technology could bury some of these companies. Ethanol is hot right now but may not be the answer. Diesel may not be the answer either.
So, yes, it’s all about the dollar but it’s not a secret and not that difficult to understand. And it’s definitely not Bush/Cheney/Big Oil or we shareholders of those oil companies.
C
Well Chuck, I don’t see it as a huge leap. I’m not a conspiracy theorist, but it’s public knowledge the Bush and his boys are huge oil shareholders. From your last paragraph (”we shareholders”), it would appear that you are too, so I wouldn’t expect you to agree with my opinion.
As to how deisel will hurt Oil profits: I don’t buy that Americans will drive more if gas is cheaper. Have we curbed our driving since gas went from $1.50 to $3.00/gal.? No, as a matter of fact, it’s well known that Americans are still driving more and (stupidly) buying SUV’s.
If we share one thing in common, I agree that a contributing factor is that the auto companies don’t want to invest in technology that may soon be obsolete. I made similar remarks to a piece here a few months ago on hydrogen powered cars. Just like deisel, H2 is a promising technology, but without an infrastructure, it’s doomed. That’s why Honda pulled the plug on the h2-powered Civic. Unless big oil (and yes, big government) are one board, the auto mfrs won’t invest in the technology. And good luck getting Big Oil to accept lower profits (see my original comments) and good luck getting Bushy to do ANYTHING that will potentially take profits away from Big Business.
Jackson,
It’s not only a huge leap it’s a ridiculous leap. This thread is about GM and it’s future in the diesel business but you elected to use it as a tool to slam Bush.
Bush, “Big Oil”, Cheney etc do not control the auto businesss. GM management determines what’s good for it’s future. Period.
I’m not sure what “opinion” you think I agree with but that’s just another huge, ridiculous leap.
Obviously you didn’t study business or economics in school. Higher prices deter economic activity and lower prices increase economic activity. If you think people won’t drive more if it costs less you just aren’t paying attention.
lastly, yes I own stock in several companies and I would assume(unless you’re homeless) you own some mutual funds, 401K, IRA or a retirement fund somewhere? If some of your funds aren’t invested in energy of some kind, you’re in the wrong fund. And, I wouldn’t want any investment of mine wanting to “lower” their profits voluntarily. Nor would I want the government to step in and take profits away from “Big Business”. If that’s the type of government you like, maybe you should move to Venezeula.
IMO, GM is hedging it’s bets that Flex fuel will be good in the short run and isn’t ready to invest in a fuel source that may be obsolete shortly.
C
My thoughts GMC along with all of the other mfg. are dragging their– because
they have to dispose of their present
gas hogs. to put the diesel out now means thay would have to eat a lot of gas hogs. Diesel Delievers 30-40% better
mpg . We would be the winners. Now the
Feds, States ,Oil-Co, Ins-Co. and Car mfg all make money off of you and I.
By the way I owned a Olds.Diesel at one time I got 30 MPG. big beautiful car
with the inprovement of the Diesel engine and transmission . We should be driving cars getting 50-60 MPG
I love Bob Lutz. He and like minded American auto executives are the reason Japan will win the peace against America. They lack the understanding that giving customers what they want, will increase profits. Keep pushing gas guzzlers, Bob. You are great!
GM is missing the boat. We have a tahoe and 2 vw jettas 2006 diesels. 47 miles a gallon. Would love to see a diesel used in tahoe. low 30 miles to the gallon .I will be looking at a bmw or mercedes diesel suv. Good luck GM.
GM is clueless. They make the best diesel truck engine, the 6.6 duramax, but won’t put it in the suburban, tahoe or half ton truck. This engine or a slightly detuned version would be a perfect way to inprove the MPG of GM’s most profitable line.